John: My father was a local physician. He was an OB and World War II veteran. He always told himself that if he survived the war, that he was going to give back in a large way to humanity. And he did. Many years ago, about, oh, mid-1960s, he started taking trips to what I'll call third world countries, which were very third world back then, they're more developed now. But he would go on his time and his money and go and establish healthcare clinics or bring medical aid and services to some of these villages that never saw a physician, let alone somebody from the United States who was kind and compassionate towards them. Many of his trips included me. As I got a little older, a lot of Central America, a lot of Belize, British Honduras, Nicaragua. He was also a Rotarian, the Grand Rapids Rotary Club. They have a program involved with eradicating polio. And it's a big deal for the Rotary Club around the world. And he became the mouthpiece and the face of that program. And we traveled all over the place in efforts to eradicate polio and set up clinics. And that crossed a lot of religious and cultural boundaries in some of the places we went. People were untrusting of a vaccine in some places of the world. I tend to be a little more social than I should with some of the people I meet. I'm not afraid to ask them their ethnicity or where they're from or what their background is. So that's my travel stuff.
Jill: Oh, that is really interesting. It sounds like it was a very formative experience to be able to travel at such a young age and get different perspectives on how folks lived. I wish I had more of that myself.
John: It took my father a lot of prodding and lesson teaching to say they're not less off or worse off than anybody else because they don't realize they don't have it. And that was a big part of my growing up. And a lot of part of my adult life was saying, pretty much be content with what you have and look around at others that have less, look around at others that have much more. My motto in life is ‘live where your feet are.’ Take what you have now and be peaceful with it and love the ones around you. How about you, do you get to travel much?
Jill: Not as much as I would like necessarily, partially because of my husband's work, but that will change eventually once he's retired. And I can't say that I've had the experience of traveling where I really get to experience a different culture. That's one reason I volunteer, hear personal stories locally where I might not necessarily be exposed to them if I were just doing things socially.
John: My travel plans changed dramatically. I retired when I was 59 with the intent of my wife and I doing some traveling. But my health changed. I was diagnosed with something called amyloidosis, which is a protein that malforms in your body and attacks your organs. So, it's gotten my kidneys pretty bad, and it's gotten my heart. And so, with those two things being worked on now, it's near impossible for me to travel for a time. How were you raised and what did your childhood look like?
Jill: I was raised in the suburbs of Chicago. My dad was from California and my mom was from Canada. There was some sense that local community was a little bit harder to come by compared to some of my friends because I didn't have a big family. And I also moved when I was nine years old. So, I think that's one reason that my exploration of community as an adult after having moved to Michigan has been like, okay, so how do I get a sense of community? Because this is echoing what I experienced as a kid where I kind of have to set this up for myself.
John: My childhood was pretty normal in the scope of American culture. I have two older sisters; they are both adopted as well. All three of us have known we've been adopted since day one. We never knew any different. My father used to say, you better behave or I'm taking you back, I saved the receipt and I'm taking you back to Sears. But he always thought that was funny. Raised in the suburbs of Grand Rapids, stayed in Grand Rapids till I was done with high school, went to Minnesota for college and went on about it from there.
Jill: My husband was adopted.
John: Boy, that's the whole subject that I could go on and on and on about. Jill, could you briefly describe in your own words your personal political values and social causes you are passionate about?
Jill: As far as personal political values, I sometimes don't really love identifying with a particular party. I find that I want to balance politically that sense of freedom to choose for oneself and then also like how one lives their life, and I want that for others. But I also want the sense that people across the broad spectrum of community can thrive and have the support that they need. There's some level playing field where people can get what they want. Sometimes that seems to be more associated with the Democratic Party, but I'm sure other people would have different opinions and that's sort of why I was drawn to a conversation like this, because I appreciate that everybody comes from a different perspective. And social causes, recently I've actually come to appreciate building community locally by getting a sense of what folks need or want to change. Listening to people who say, oh, we would like more access to healthcare, we would like more access to mental healthcare, we want more access to childcare and finding out ways that we can work with local organizations and local county commissioners to maybe make that easier for folks.
John: I feel similar. I would tend to be more towards the conservative side of things. I'm a Christian and I find it a lot in my Christian values to have people earn what they get. I too would like to see people get everything they can out of life, but it bothers me from the liberal standpoint a bit that things like tuition reimbursement, things like living off the government, which seems to be a lifestyle anymore versus a handout, it's hard to separate that in reality. Who gets it? Who doesn't? But there are certain things liberally that I absolutely agree with, but there are probably more things that I agree with from a Republican side of things. Now, I am not a fan of the Republican party right now. Just a lot of just non-truth. I think on both sides, you know, there's just not a lot of truth going on. My social causes are getting smaller in nature now. I'm very involved in the homeless situation. I think it's a great tragedy. Communities are not caring for our most vulnerable people. It comes back to mental health care, medical care. They just don't get it. And nobody has the resources or finds the resources to put people into crisis prevention mode. So, I do a lot of that. I do a lot of just yearly kind of stuff where I'll take supplies down to the homeless. Just recently brought all of our blankets and coats and pillows down for the homeless and what does it do? It makes your day five minutes better, but you know you hope that somehow, they see somebody loves them and somebody cares for them. The other thing that I really like to be involved in is the Grand Rapids Community Foundation. Our family has been involved with that for many years. My parents have a scholarship program through them for kids that need college money.
Jill: You don't want anyone to be invisible. And I think the homeless often feel like they're invisible. I appreciate that you take the time to make sure they feel like part of the community. And I guess that's one reason with the local stuff, politics can feel like a game sometimes. Whether it's on the local level or on the state or national. I wish people were more focused on solving problems for people, not necessarily handing out stuff, but making sure that the systems of community work for them.
John: Jill, what's something you'll take with you from this experience?
Jill: It provides hope that there are folks like you, John, who have a kind of complicated view of community and politics, that it's not just my side or die. Like you, when I'm talking to other Democrats to raise questions, that might be one of the things that I have to do more often. I appreciate that you sometimes can share even a little bit of a different of opinion with folks who may have a similar view, but kind of like to see a pretty narrow view of politics. What's something that you will take from this experience, John?
John: It's a good reminder that there are way, way more good people in the world and there are bad, and that everybody's curious. This is something, it's nice to meet somebody. It's nice to have a conversation with somebody that may or may not agree, but you can still have a conversation about the issues and about life. It reminds me that people don't oftentimes think so differently. We're not so different. And that so many of us have hope for the future. So many of us have hope for our communities and are grateful to be where we are in life and able to connect with different communities.
Jill: You said something in the beginning when you were growing up, ‘this is where my feet are right now.’
John: Live where your feet are.
Jill: And if it's the conversation you're in, then put aside what all the news says for a little while and engage in the conversation. And I feel like we've been pretty good at that.